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  • Tibet - Myth and Reality

    2008-04-14 3:07PM / 標準BLOG / Thoughts / 會員可以看
    15個評論

    by Foster Stockwell

    (I found this profound article on Patty Keungs blog and tried to verify its source which I could trace back to this site.)

    About the author (1):

    Foster Stockwell is a publishing consultant for Chinese publishers and authors. He is also the author of A Sourcebook for Genealogical Research: Resources Alphabetically by Type and Location (2004) and A History of Information Storage and Retrieval (2001). He lives in Des Moines, Washington.

    About the author (2):

    Foster Stockwell is an American writer who grew up as the son of missionaries in southwestern China (Chengdu) near Tibet, and has visited China many times in recent years. His several books include Religion in China Today (New World Press) and Mount Huashan (Foreign Languages Press).



    Myth and Reality

    Tibet's isolation and unique religious practices have made it the focus of many Western myths.

    Western concepts of Tibet embrace more myth than reality. The idea that Tibet is an oppressed nation composed of peaceful Buddhists who never did anyone any harm distorts history. In fact the belief that the Dalai Lama is the leader of world Buddhism rather than being just the leader of one sect among more than 1,700 "Living Buddhas" of this unique Tibetan form of the faith displays a parochial view of world religions.

    The myth, of course, is an outgrowth of Tibet's former inaccessibility, which has fostered illusions about this mysterious land in the midst of the Himalayan Mountains -- illusions that have been skillfully promoted for political purposes by the Dalai Lama's advocates. The myth will inevitably die, as all myths do, but until this happens, it would be wise to learn a few useful facts about this area of China.

    First, Tibet has been a part of China ever since it was merged into that country in 1239, when the Mongols began creating the Yuan Dynasty (1271-1368). This was before Marco Polo reached China from Europe and more than two centuries before Columbus sailed to the New World. True, China's hold on this area sometimes appeared somewhat loose, but neither the Chinese nor many Tibetans have ever denied that Tibet has been a part of China from the Yuan Dynasty to this very day.

    The early Tibetans evolved into a number of competing nomadic tribes and developed a religion known as Bon that was led by shamans who conducted rituals that involved the sacrifice of many animals and some humans. These tribes fought battles with each other for better grazing lands, battles in which they killed or made slaves of those they conquered. They roamed far beyond the borders of Tibet into areas of China's Sichuan and Yunnan provinces, Xinjiang, Gansu, and Qinghai. Eventually one of these tribes, the Tubo, became the most powerful and took control of all Tibet. (The name Tibet comes from Tubo.) During China's Tang Dynasty (618-907), Emperor Taizong improved relations with the Tubo king, Songtsen Gampo, by giving him one of his daughters, Princess Wenzheng, in marriage. The Tubos, in response to this cementing of relations, developed close fraternal ties with the Tang court, and the two ruling powers regularly exchanged gifts.

    The princess arrived in Tibet with an entourage of hundreds of servants, skilled craftspeople, and scribes. She was a Buddhist, as were all of the Tang emperors, and so Buddhism entered Tibet mainly through her influence, only to be suppressed later by resentful Bon shamans. Some years later another Tang princess was married to another Tubo king, again to cement relations between the two rulers.

    The fact that the Tibetans and the Chinese had united royal families and engaged actively in trade (Tibetan horses for tea of the Central Plain) didn't mean an absence of conflict between them. Battles occasionally occurred between Tang and Tubo troops, mostly over territorial issues. At one point in the 750s, the Tubos, taking advantage of a rebellion against the Tangs by other armed groups in China, raced on horseback across China to enter the Tang capital of Chang'an. But, they couldn't hold the city.

    In 838, the Tubo king was assassinated by two pro-Bon ministers, and the Bon religion was re-established as the only acceptable religion in Tibet. Buddhists were widely persecuted and forced into hiding.

    Trade between Tibet and the interior areas continued during the Five Dynasties (907-960) and the Song Dynasty (960-1279) that followed the collapse of the Tang, although relations between the two ruling powers were limited. During this time Buddhism revived in Tibet as a result of the Buddhists' willingness to accommodate some Bon practices. The form of Buddhism that resulted from this merging of the two religions was quite different from that of China and other countries in Southeast Asia, as well as from the form that had been practiced previously in Tibet.

    Tibetan Buddhism, often called Lamaism, appealed to the Mongols, who conquered most of Russia, parts of Europe, and all of China under the leadership of Genghis Khan. The Mongols, like the Tibetans, were tribal herders who had a religion of animism similar to Bon.

    When Kublai Khan, the first Yuan emperor, appointed administrators to Tibet, he elevated the head of the Tibetan Buddhist Sakya sect to the post of leader of all Buddhists in China, thus giving this monk greater power than any Buddhist had ever held before - and probably since. Needless to say, the appointment irritated the leaders of the other Buddhist sects in Tibet and the much larger group of non-Tibetan Buddhists in China. But, they couldn't do anything to counter the wishes of the emperor.

    The Yuan Dynasty divided Tibet into a series of administrative areas and put these areas under the charge of an imperial preceptor. Furthermore, the Yuan court encouraged the growth of feudal estates in Tibet as a way to maintain control there.

    When the Yuan Dynasty collapsed, it was replaced by the Ming Dynasty (1368-1644), which wasn't composed of persons of Mongolian heritage. Tibet then became splintered because the Ming court adopted a policy of granting hereditary titles to many nobles and a policy of divide and rule.

    Although the Ming court conferred the honorific title of Desi (ruling lama) to the head of one of Tibet's most powerful families, the Rinpung family, they also bestowed enough official titles to his subordinates to encourage separatist trends within the local Tibetan society. One of these titles was given to the head of the newly founded Gelugpa sect, better known as the Yellow sect. He later took on the title "Dalai Lama."


    Tibet During the Qing Dynasty
    The next and last dynasty, the Qing, came to power in 1644 and lasted until 1911. At the time of its founding, the most prominent Tibetan religious and secular leaders were the fifth Dalai Lama, the fourth Panchen Lama, and Gushri Khan. They formed a delegation that arrived at the Chinese capital, Beijing, in 1652.

    Before they returned to Tibet the following year, the emperor officially conferred upon Lozang Gyatso (the then Dalai Lama), the honorific title "The Dalai Lama, Buddha of Great Compassion in the West, Leader of the Buddhist Faith Beneath the Sky, Holder of the Vajra." (Dalai is Mongolian for "ocean"; lama is a Tibetan word that means "guru.")

    The fifth Dalai Lama pledged his allegiance to the Qing government and in return, received enough gold and silver to build 13 new monasteries of the Yellow sect in Tibet. All successive reincarnations of the Dalai Lama have been confirmed by the central government in China, and this has become a historical convention practiced to this very day.

    A later Qing emperor suspected the intentions of the seventh Dalai Lama, so he increased the power of the Panchen Lama (also of the Yellow sect). In 1713 the Qing court granted the title "Panchen Erdeni" to the fifth Panchen Lama, thus elevating him to a status similar to that given to the Dalai Lama (Panchen means "great scholar" in Sanskrit, and Erdeni means "treasure" in Manchu.)

    The largest part of the Tibetan population (more than 90 percent) at that time was composed of serfs, who were treated harshly by the landlords and ruling monks. All monasteries had large tracts of land as well as a great number of serfs under their control. The ruling monks' exploitation of these serfs was just as severe as that of the aristocratic landlords.

    Serfs had no personal freedom from birth to death. They and their children were given freely as gifts or donations, sold or bartered for goods. They were, in fact, viewed by landlords as "livestock that can speak." As late as 1943, a high-ranking aristocrat named Tsemon Norbu Wangyal sold 100 serfs to a monk in the Drigung area for only four silver dollars per serf.

    If serfs lost their ability to work, the lord confiscated all their property, including livestock and farm tools. If they ran away and subsequently were captured, half their personal belongings were given to the captors while the other half went to the lords for whom they worked. The runaways then were flogged or even condemned to death.

    The lords used such inhuman tortures as gouging out eyes, cutting off feet or hands, pushing the condemned person over a cliff, drowning and beheading.Numerous rebellions occurred over the years against this harsh treatment, and in 1347 alone (the seventh year of Yuan Emperor Shundi's reign), more than 200 serf rebellions occurred in Tibet.


    Foreign Aggression
    Foreign nations made numerous attempts to invade Tibet and take it away from China. These were repulsed by Chinese troops and Tibetan fighters. The first such invasion took place in 1337 when Mohammed Tugluk of Delhi (in what is now India) sent 100,000 troops into the Himalayan area.

    During the second half of the 18th century, troops from the Kingdom of Nepal invaded Tibet twice in an attempt to expand Nepal's territory.

    During the 19th century, Britain competed with Russia in pouring large sums of money and many spies into a struggle to see which of the two might eventually occupy and control Tibet. When the British finally invaded Tibet, first in 1888 and again in 1903, the Russians were so involved in conflicts at home that they couldn't stop the British troops from pushing all the way to Lhasa. And the Qing government, having recently lost the Opium War to the British, did nothing either.

    The Tibetans, using spears, arrows, catapults and homemade guns, fought valiantly but to no avail against the invading British army and its big cannons and machine guns. The British withdrew after imposing "peace" terms and before the harsh winter began because they feared the Tibetan resistance would prevent supplies from getting through to the occupying troops, thereby causing them to starve to death.

    The British signed a Convention with China in 1906, the second article of which stipulated that the British would no longer interfere with the administration of Tibet and that China had sovereignty over Tibet. But, they conveniently forgot the terms of this agreement when, the very next year, they signed a Convention with Russia that specified British "special interests" in Tibet. It would probably fill a book to detail the many ways the British from that point on tried to take over Tibet and make it a part of their colony of India.

    Yet, something needs to be said about the conference held at Simla, India, in 1914. Conference participants included representatives of the new Nationalist government of China that had overthrown the Qing Dynasty just two years before, plus Tibetans, and British-Indians. The British had blackmailed the Chinese into attending by threatening to withdraw their recognition of the new nationalist government and by saying they would work out an agreement with the Tibetans alone if the Chinese didn't participate.

    The Simla Conference failed because the Chinese and the 13th Dalai Lama both opposed the British plan to divide Tibet into two parts (Inner and Outer Tibet). The conference, however, did produce one document that since has caused dissension -- a map drawn by the British representative Arthur H. McMahon that never was shown to the Chinese, although it was revealed secretly to the Tibetan delegates.

    McMahon's map showed a new boundary line that included three districts of Tibet -- Monyul, Loyul, and Lower Zayul -- within the territory of British- India. This so-called "McMahon Line" first became public 23 years later when it appeared in a printed set of British documents related to the conference and other diplomatic matters. The McMahon Line became the basis for India's failed attempt to take over this part of Tibet in 1962. The British, who made a great show of their desire to have "independence for Tibet" at the Simla Conference, in drawing this map were adding 90,000 square kilometers  (an area three times the size of Belgium) from Tibet's natural territory to their own Indian colony.

    During and after World War II and shortly before Britain's departure from India, the American Office of Strategic Services (O.S.S., the forerunner of the C.I.A.), operating under Cold War guidelines, joined the British Foreign Office as the instigator of the Tibetan "freedom movement."

    Much of what the O.S.S. did in Tibet remains hidden in secret files at C.I.A headquarters near Washington, D.C., but one of their plots has been widely reported. It involved a smear campaign launched against the regent who had been appointed to act for the young 14th Dalai Lama after the 13th Dalai died in 1933. The regent was hostile to U.S.-British intrigues in Tibet, so the O.S.S. spread rumors about his alleged incompetence and criminal activities. Eventually these charges led to the regent's arrest and murder in a Tibetan prison. The 14th Dalai Lama's father subsequently was poisoned because he was a friend and supporter of the regent.


    Tibetan Buddhism
    Before considering Tibet today, some words should be said about Tibetan Buddhism as a religion. The accommodations it made with Bon resulted in its becoming very different from other forms of Buddhism, particularly from the more common and much larger Chan Buddhism of China (called Zen in Japan). Images found in Tibetan Buddhist temples are much fiercer than those found in other Buddhist temples, and some Tibetan ceremonies that once used human skulls, human skin, and fresh human intestines clearly reflect the animistic elements of Bon.

    Also, Tibetan Buddhists rely a great deal on prayer wheels, which most other Buddhists scorn. These are mechanical devices with prayers written on them that are constantly turned by water or wind so the forces of nature do the work of sending prayers to heaven.

    The reincarnation of Living Buddhas, which is unique to this form of Buddhism, began as early as 1294 with the Karma Kagyu sect, a sub-sect of the Kagyu sect (known as the black hats). It then spread to all of Tibetan Buddhism's other sects and monasteries, but it didn't reach the Gelugpa sect (the one that includes the Dalai and Panchen Lama lines) until after 1419.

    From the beginning, the system of selecting Living Buddhas was open to abuse because it was easy for clever members of the monk selection committee to manipulate the objects presented to potential child candidates in order to make sure a particular child was chosen. In the case of the fourth Dalai Lama, the child selected was the great-grandson of the Mongolian chief Altan Khan. He was chosen at a time when the Gelugpa sect badly needed the protection of the Altan Khan's followers because the Gelugpa were being persecuted by the older Tibetan sects, who were jealous of the Yellow sect's rapid growth.


    Tibet Since 1949
    In 1949, the Chinese Communists won the revolution and overthrew the Nationalist government. But they didn't send their army into Tibet until October 1951, after they and Tibetan representatives of the 14th Dalai Lama and 10th Panchen Lama had signed an agreement to liberate Tibet peacefully. The Dalai Lama expressed his support for this 17-point agreement in a telegraphed message to Chairman Mao on October 24, 1951. Three years later the Dalai and Panchen Lamas went together to Beijing to attend the first National People's Congress at which the Dalai Lama was elected vice-chairman of the Standing Committee and the Panchen Lama was elected a member of that committee. After the People's Liberation Army (PLA) entered Tibet, they took steps to protect the rights of the serfs but didn't, at first, try to reorganize Tibetan society along socialist or democratic lines. Yet, the landlords and ruling monks knew that in time, their land would be redistributed, just as the landlords' property in the rest of China had been confiscated and divided among the peasants.

    The Tibetan landlords did all they could to frighten the serfs away from associating with the PLA. But, as the serfs increasingly ignored their landlords' wishes and called on the Communists to eliminate the oppressive system of serfdom, some leaders of the "three great monasteries" (Ganden, Sera, and Drepung) issued a statement, in the latter half of 1956, demanding the feudal system be maintained. At this point, the PLA decided the time had come to confiscate the landlords' property and redistribute it among the serfs. The landlords and top-level monks retaliated by announcing, in March 1959, the founding of a "Tibet Independent State," and about 7,000 of them assembled in Lhasa to stage a revolt. Included were more than 170 "Khampa guerrillas" who had been trained overseas by the O.S.S. and air-dropped into Tibet, according to a former C.I.A. agent. The O.S.S. also gave them machine guns, mortars, rifles and ammunition.

    The PLA put down the revolt in Lhasa within two days, capturing some 4,000 rebels. The rebellion had the support of the Dalai Lama, but not of the Panchen Lama. After it failed, the Dalai Lama, along with a group of rebel leaders, fled to India.

    The most disruptive event of recent years was the "cultural revolution," which lasted from 1966 to 1976. It turned most of Tibet's farm and herding areas into giant communes and closed or destroyed many monasteries and temples, just as it did elsewhere in China. At its end, the communes were disbanded and the temples and monasteries were repaired and reopened at government expense.

    The idea that most Tibetans are unhappy about what has happened in Tibet and want independence from China is a product manufactured in the West and promoted by the dispossessed landlords who fled to India. Indeed, to believe it is true stretches logic to its breaking point. Who really can believe that a million former serfs - more than 90% of the population - are unhappy about having the shackles of serfdom removed? They now care for their own herds and farmland, marry whomever they wish without first getting their landlord's permission, aren't punished for disrespecting these same landlords, own their own homes, attend school, and have relatively modern hospitals, paved roads, airports and modern industries.

    An objective measure of this progress is found in the population statistics. The Tibetan population has doubled since 1950, and the average Tibetan's life span has risen from 36 years at that time to 65 years at present.

    Of course some Tibetans are unhappy with their lot, but a little investigation soon shows that they are, for the most part, people from families who lost their landlord privileges. There is plenty of evidence that the former serfs tell a quite different story.

    You will find some Tibetans who hate the Hans (the majority nationality of China) and some Hans who hate the Tibetans, a matter of ordinary ethnic prejudice ­ something any American should be able to understand. But, this doesn't represent a desire for an independent Tibet any more than black- white hostilities in Washington, D.C., Detroit, or Boston represent a desire on the part of most African-Americans to form a separate nation.


    Tibetan Culture Today
    The final part of the Tibetan myth has to do with Tibetan culture, which the Dalai Lama's supporters say has been crushed by "the Chinese takeover of Tibet." Culture is an area that requires great care because it is fraught with biases and self-fulfilling judgments. The growth of television in America, for example, is cited as killing American culture by some and as enhancing it by others.

    Regarding the field of literature, prior to 1950 Tibetans could point with pride to only a few fine epics that had been passed down through the centuries. Now that serfs can become authors, many new writers are producing works of great quality; persons such as the poet Yedam Tsering and the fiction writers Jampel Gyatso, Tashi Dawa, and Dondru Wangbum.

    As for art, Tibet for centuries had produced nothing but repetitious religious designs for temples. Now there are many fine artists, such as Bama Tashi, who has been hailed in both France and Canada as a great modern artist who combines Tibetan religious themes with modern pastoral images.

    Tibet now has more than 30 professional song and dance ensembles, Tibetan opera groups, and other theatrical troupes where none existed before 1950.

    No, Tibetan culture is not dead; it is flourishing as never before.


BLOG評論 (15)

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  • pattykeung
    藝術家空間 
    留言於2008-04-19 1:38PM [举报]
    Different Cultures Different Standards

    A while back, I’ve gone for a holiday to the Philippines with a bunch of friends.  One day, we witnessed a Filipino kid do something dangerous and was told by his grand mum that if he does it again, his hands would be “chopped off” !!

    Following are the different reactions by my Hong Kong girlfriend and my American girlfriend.

    AMERICAN GIRL:
    How can they say such thing to a kid?
    It is so violent!  It must have given nightmares
    to the kid.

    HONG KONG GIRL:
    No.  The grandmum is saying this to prevent the kid from doing this again.  Actually, she wants to protect the kid!

    HONG KONG GIRL:
    I used to admire Woody Allen a lot, but not after he has seduced his stepdaughter.  She was ONLY 15 years old!  That is so inmoral!

    AMERICAN GIRL:
    Hey, she was ALREADY 15 years old!  She’s not that young! Besides, she was never Woody Allen’s step daughter.  She was only the step daughter of Mia Farrow (Woody Allen's girlfriend then) and the step sister of Woody Allen and Mia Farrow’s biological child and their adopted children!

    AMERICAN GIRL:
    How is it to be ruled by the Chinese?  You guys in Hong Kong can’t vote for your own Chief Executive in Hong Kong, right?

    HONG KONG GIRL:
    You are right.  We can’t.   So, on the 6th anniversary of Hong Kong's handover back to China (i.e. on July 1st, 2002) half a million Hong Kongers, marched peacefully on the streets to express our discontents towards the government.  Considering that it was a very hot day and the narrow streets of Hong Kong were packed full of impatient Hong Kong people, but NOT A SINGLE DUSTBIN WAS BEING KICKED OVER.  Since we were so peaceful, the Chinese Government need not to suppress us but gave us a new Chief Executive in less than 2 years time!  In fact, we are continuously "fighting" to get direct election for our Chief Executive.  We know that it will happen, but it is done in progression instead of overnight.  If we are too radical, we would go backwards instead of forwards.

    AMERICAN GIRL:
    So, what do you think about the Olympic Games and Tibet?

    HONG KONG GIRL:
    With all my heart, I think it is only fair to all the world athletes and to China that the world should not mix these issues.   You see, due to our different backgrounds and perspectives, we will always see things differently.  Even a High Court judge friend of mine says that however fair he tries to be at every judgment, there will always be one side happy and one side unhappy.  But I just sincerely hope that people will not disrupt the Olympic Games events any more.  Let us use this once every 4 years chance to have some fun together instead!
  • AQIU
    留言於2008-04-17 10:47AM [举报]
    Dear Flagday:
         I read your response twice to make sure I've fully got what you said.
         Still I have some question to ask, although such things as discussion usually have no outcome.
    I do come from the Mainland of China, and have generally no access to uncensored sources. You said these two things are mutually exclusive, maybe you are right, but to get some facts of this story and having no access to uncensored sources are not mutually exclusive. You said that’s an opinion piece pretending to be a history, but don’t you feel that what you said was also an opinion piece pretending to be fair, or as you said , to be scholarly and journalistic? Don’t you think you have a tendency? Or may I say prejudice? Uncensored sources are not all true, probably they are just prejudices, you just need to take a look at cnn.com and newpapers and television in your western countries and you will know that. In this sense I’ve already got some uncensored sources, I can go to yahoo to see what they say about Tibet, though this website is not as notorious as cnn who has no journalistic attitude towards riots happened in Tibet at all though most of its workers are journalists. Besides, there’s a lot of Chinese international students abroad and they have an access to what you called uncensored sources, and what’s their opinion? They just built a website called anti-cnn.com, because they are aware what they see are mostly prejudice, and some of them are even very malicious ones.
    You proposed that the Tibetans vote to decide whether Tibet belong or not belong to China. I’d rather prefer to see this. Because I suspect the answer is “no” , which is totally different from yours.As you said , this is not going to happen, why? You must know that there’s no country in the world is willing to see this .Just take China as an example. The Taiwanese want to vote, the Tibetans want to vote ( in fact not the Taiwanese, not the Tibetans, not most of them want to see this, but those who wants more power want to vote. at least I am sure the Tibetans are very content with their status ), will there be one day people from Shanghai, Hongkong , Jiangsu province tell Beijing that they also want to vote because they want to be independent? Which country can bear to see this? This is just not practical. I know there’s also an unpleasant history between the Black people and the White people in the USA and this history is not ended till now. Will Bush allow such a vote that will give the Black people freedom and independence? Never. So won’t China. Not to mention most of the Tibetans don't need and don’t want such a vote.
    You said “the people interviewed have to do it in private, behind closed doors, lest they get arrested. “ I doubt how you know this. There are no so many policemen in China. I myself sometimes feel not content with something in China and I say to my classmates that how heidious this politician is and how disgusting that is. Of course in private. No policeman came to arrest me. Will Tibet be a totally different scene? I suspect.
    Okay so much for this. This is already very long. I also hope that I din’t offend you by saying this. I’m just telling you what I trully feel and actually see in China. Anyway I’m glad to have such a discussion with you.
    Best regards.

                                                           Yours sincereyly
                                                            Aqiu
                                                           2008-4-17
  • silky
    留言於2008-04-17 2:41AM
    It's up to you to get riled or not...
    I'm tired of the onesided press full of prejudices and resentiments - at least this article included many facts, though he includes a clear opinion...
  • Flagday
    留言於2008-04-17 1:40AM [举报]
    Aqiu - I see from your sig pic you love Mao.  But you can't love everything that Mao did, right?  There's always another side to the story.  Are you from the Mainland or do you have access to uncensored sources?  I'm just wondering because I think those two things are mutually exclusive.  

    I have not been surprised to see Chinese nationals' perspective on this. I think they've only ever heard one side of the story.  I had a nice discussion with another poster whose posts are pretty much 95% supportive of the the PRC's position.  I just said this opinion piece was propaganda from an historian's and a logic perspective -- it's an opinion piece pretending to be a history.  Look, my degree is in American history not Chinese history but I know pseudo-history and logical fallacies when I see them.  As I said before, the truth probably lies somewhere in between the two perspectives.  I would really like to read a fair and balanced analysis from both perspectives.  

    On a practical, pragmatic side, Tibet doesn't stand a chance asserting independence from China, a permanent member of the Security Council at the UN.  

    Whether or not the Tibetans themselves would desire more autonomy and the reinstatement of the Dalai Lama in Lasha, I have no idea.  I suspect the answer is "yes" but better yet, why not put it to a vote?  That's not going to happen obviously but you don't know how the Tibetans feel about living under Chinese rule than I do.  I know that every time I real of such an account, the people interviewed have to do it in private, behind closed doors, lest they get arrested.  

    As I said below, the truth lies somewhere in between.  I am waiting to hear a scholarly almost journalistic approach to this issue with no conclusions drawn, just all the facts stated.   

    I am perfectly aware that the Western press also has a bias, left over from the Cold War.  

    Don't take personal offense.  I question everything. I'm a certified cynic.  I don't believe anything any government tells me, including my own.

    You see Silky?  These kinds of posts just get people riled.
  • AQIU
    留言於2008-04-16 10:29PM [举报]
    Something I want to say to Taijiquangirl and Flagday.
    I don’t mean to argue with anybody, but if there’s no reason for you to be so self-asseritive, you may listen to some explanation of mine, I bet you know less than I know about China and Tibet, China.
    Taijiquangirl: you said  “it would be the same like belgium would say africa is a part of its country”. Now I want to tell you : you are right, absolutely right, if the relationship between Belgium and Africa is the same as that of China and Tibet. It is a well-known ( who denies it ? who can tell me?) fact that Tibet is a part of China now, it’s a fact accepted by most of the countries in the world. But how many countries nowadays in the world regard Africa as a part of Belgium? So , basing on this fact, I am sorry to tell you that you are wrong, totally wrong. This is too completely different cases.
    Second, Dalai Lama himself said he’s not a seperalist, he accepts the well-accepted fact that Tibet is part of China. But he seems not doing what he says, so we say Dalai Lama’s a fraud.
    As for “the cruched part” and “ came back shoqued”, I don’t know what they mean due to my poor English but I guess they mean “ the crushed part” and “ shocked”. We don’t care whether your friend was shocked , this is not the key point, the key point is, whether we have the right to “crush” them ( this is the word you use but let's accept it now ). We just want to know which country today can bear to see rioters burning houses, killing citizen without any movement, the USA? France? Germany? Or the UK? We just did what we should do. I’m proud of the PLA if they once did anything that would benefit most of the Tibetans, most of the Chinese people.

    Flagday: you said “ this article is pure propaganda”, but are you so sure that what you learn in newpapers, in television in your country are not propaganda? Are you so sure what Dalai Lama says , no matter what he says, is truth and what the Chinese government says are, no matter what they say, just telling lies? “ If you read Tibetan exile propaganda they say they always had a relationship with China but always considered themselves independent. “ Dalai Lama represents whom? His own class , not most of the Tibetans whose mama or Dad or grandma or grandfa were once serfs and suffered tortures from the upper-class ariscrats of the Tibetan society and Dalai Lama himself. In this sense, the western media, some of your western politicians are just helping bad people doing bad things. Tibetan people will not be grateful to you, but they will hate you.
  • Bartek
    留言於2008-04-15 7:27PM [举报]
    Seems interesting, When I will have more free time I will read it,   ...difficult vocabulary
  • silky
    留言於2008-04-14 8:01PM
    by posting this, I did not say I agree totally with the author...but I neither considered it as propaganda...it's just a different opinion.
  • Flagday
    留言於2008-04-14 7:43PM [举报]
    That's exactly right.  You have to compare today with today and not with what happened in the past.  This article is pure propaganda no better than if the Chinese government wrote it.  Katia's right. If you take this article's theories to the ultimate extension they why wouldn't Kublai Khan's successors in Mongolia ruling all of China?  If you read Tibetan exile propaganda they say they always had a relationship with China but always considered themselves independent.  The truth lies somewhere in between.
  • silky
    留言於2008-04-14 6:45PM
    Katia, I think your comparision is impropre. And you have to differ between the society in the past and the situation now, and who acts in whose interests..
  • mengyao
    藝術家空間 
    留言於2008-04-14 6:06PM [举报]
    hi,silky,does it has chinese edition?
  • JoanneSanderson
    留言於2008-04-14 4:07PM [举报]
    I have to say that the West does just tend to see one side to this story. This article is very interesting and enlightening to read. Thanks Silky.
  • taijiquangirl
    留言於2008-04-14 3:33PM [举报]
    But part of china i find douthfull because it would be the same like belgium would say africa is a part of its country. Because they took over it so long ago

    And for the cruched part,  my friend who didn't know of the problem came back shoqued so i find this articel more propaganda then informatif
  • pattykeung
    藝術家空間 
    留言於2008-04-14 8:42AM [举报]
    Thanks Silky for doing the Chinese justice.  I think the following video gives an even more clear view of what has happened in history and now:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xsoc4-QnplY&feature=related
  • moonchild72
    留言於2008-04-14 3:17AM [举报]
    Excellent information, Silky.. thank you for sharing it !!! :)
  • gilgamesh
    留言於2008-04-14 1:04AM [举报]
    I love your blog, Silke, super informativ. I have to copy it for myself !!!!
    Ich stehe zu Dir in dieser Angelegenheit. :)

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